Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
In article ,
Willy Eckerslyke wrote:
I did mine a few months back with advice from this group and it wasn't
as difficult as I'd expected. I screwed them out a bit, cleaned them off
with a cloth and then screwed them right back in with my fingers. Where
they were a bit stiff to begin turning, I found it possible to push the
top with a screwdriver - it didn't need enough pressure to cause any
damage.

Yup. A pair of those thin but strong building gloves can save the pain. ;-)

Not if you have fingers as thick as mine!

Do you find the handbrake now extremely effective? Long travel and spongey
feeling but very powerful?

Definitely. But then it was pretty good before too.

Usually impresses the MOT guys on the rolling
road.

This one said there was too much travel and made me adjust the handbrake
cable to take it up. The travel had increased a fair bit, which seemed
odd after fitting new pads - perhaps because whoever fitted the last lot
hadn't bothered to wind the pistons back fully.
Adjusting the cable wasn't a job I'd like to do again in a hurry as it
has to be done from below the handbrake lever and above the propshaft.
And you can't just tighten a nut, you have to unclip the cable first,
then tighten it just enough to allow you to get it back on again
afterwards. All by feel as there's not enough room to see what you're
doing and your eyes are too full of dust by then anyway.

"Conor" wrote in message
...
In article ,
campingstoveman
says...
Dave,

Thanks for the info, taking both of the rears off anyway to repair
leak so
will do it on bench. Just thinking of future, as to making one I
have the
necessary machines so it would be no problem.

I used a G clamp.


Conor, you're a total DH, you obviously know NOTHING about P6 rear
callipers!

"Conor" wrote in message
...
In article , SteveH
says...
Andy Dingley wrote:

On 17 May, 16:31, Conor wrote:

I used a G clamp.

On a P6? Isn't this a design where the handbrake mech means you
can't
simply push them back, but have to screw them in



FFS...It does screw them in. You do it so the screwthreaded bit of
the
g-clamp is acting on the bit you need to rotate and the solid bit is
on
the other side of the caliper the side the piston is on. When the g
clamp is tight enough and you continue to tighten it bites into the
piston and rotates that as well.


**** off Conor, you're either a troll or an out-and out-bodging tosser
who knows **** all about this, what you suggest is the quickest way of
wrecking the calliper! BTW I started working on these rear brakes when
they had only just gone out of production - ie. we saw a lot of them
on a daily bases.

In article ,
Willy Eckerslyke wrote:
Usually impresses the MOT guys on the rolling
road.

This one said there was too much travel and made me adjust the handbrake
cable to take it up.

That's common. Some want it to be hard on (ie you can't pull it up
further) by 4 clicks or whatever and one in correct adjustment won't be.
With enough force you can almost pull it up to the stop.

The travel had increased a fair bit, which seemed
odd after fitting new pads - perhaps because whoever fitted the last lot
hadn't bothered to wind the pistons back fully.
Adjusting the cable wasn't a job I'd like to do again in a hurry as it
has to be done from below the handbrake lever and above the propshaft.
And you can't just tighten a nut, you have to unclip the cable first,
then tighten it just enough to allow you to get it back on again
afterwards. All by feel as there's not enough room to see what you're
doing and your eyes are too full of dust by then anyway.

Indeed. What you must make sure is that the operating levers on the
calipers are well and truly on their backstops with the handbrake off -
not that it works by a random number of clicks. Otherwise the self
adjustment won't work properly. If the MOT bloke objects, show him the
workshop manual.

--
*If at first you don't succeed, redefine success.

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

"Dave Plowman (News)" wrote in message
...
In article
,
Andy Dingley wrote:
On 17 May, 23:17, "Dave Plowman (News)"
wrote:

I don't see how a g-clamp would be much help.

So it's just Doctor Drivel talking about hacksaws again.

Ouch. You know how to wound. Conor's not in the same class as
dribble -
fortunately.

But having read his explanation of how he used it I'm still not
convinced.


Sorry Dave, but after reading Conor's explanation it's clear to me
that they could be brothers, in fact they could be identical twins...

In article ,
:Jerry: wrote:

"Dave Plowman (News)" wrote in message
...
In article
,
Andy Dingley wrote:
On 17 May, 23:17, "Dave Plowman (News)"
wrote:

I don't see how a g-clamp would be much help.

So it's just Doctor Drivel talking about hacksaws again.

Ouch. You know how to wound. Conor's not in the same class as
dribble -
fortunately.

But having read his explanation of how he used it I'm still not
convinced.


Sorry Dave, but after reading Conor's explanation it's clear to me
that they could be brothers, in fact they could be identical twins...

I dunno - it's just conceivable that a G clamp with enough friction
between its 'pad' and the piston could turn the piston. But I'm sceptical.

--
*A backward poet writes inverse.*

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
In article ,
Willy Eckerslyke wrote:
Usually impresses the MOT guys on the rolling
road.

This one said there was too much travel and made me adjust the handbrake
cable to take it up.

That's common. Some want it to be hard on (ie you can't pull it up
further) by 4 clicks or whatever and one in correct adjustment won't be.

Quite. And if I'd adjusted it as tight as that I'd never have got the
cable back on again.

With enough force you can almost pull it up to the stop.

Not sure about that, I don't want to risk breaking the cable and having
to get back underneath again.

Indeed. What you must make sure is that the operating levers on the
calipers are well and truly on their backstops with the handbrake off -
not that it works by a random number of clicks. Otherwise the self
adjustment won't work properly. If the MOT bloke objects, show him the
workshop manual.

He was happy enough once I'd reduced the travel a bit and it's been
behaving correctly for the few months since the test. He only retested
it by driving across his forecourt, so I reckon he'd already found they
were reading high enough anyway.

"Dave Plowman (News)" wrote in message
...
In article ,
:Jerry: wrote:

"Dave Plowman (News)" wrote in message
...
In article
,
Andy Dingley wrote:
On 17 May, 23:17, "Dave Plowman (News)"
wrote:

I don't see how a g-clamp would be much help.

So it's just Doctor Drivel talking about hacksaws again.

Ouch. You know how to wound. Conor's not in the same class as
dribble -
fortunately.

But having read his explanation of how he used it I'm still not
convinced.


Sorry Dave, but after reading Conor's explanation it's clear to me
that they could be brothers, in fact they could be identical
twins...

I dunno - it's just conceivable that a G clamp with enough friction
between its 'pad' and the piston could turn the piston. But I'm
sceptical.


But a G clamp will exert a pushing force to that is likely to damage
the ratchet mechanism as well as rotating the 'outer' piston, all the
proper Rover tool does (and all that is required) is a turning motion
[1] - what Conor is suggesting is like suggesting one can torque a
bolt down using a sledge-hammer, sure the force applied force the two
components together (akin to riveting...) but in doing so one is sure
to damage the fixing. What I'm saying is, the G clamp will exert far
more of a pushing force that it will a rotational force due to the
pitch of the respective threads (pitch of G clamp thread vs. the
thread of the adjuster)

Anyway, the only way one could get a G clamp onto a P6 rear calliper
is to remove the unit first, rather suggests that Conor hasn't even
seen the P6 rear brake assembly let alone worked on it...

[1] even more modern designs don't like a pushing force applied, the
proper tools are designed to exert a turning force only, the means to
apply a pushing force is greatly limited by the design so that it
basically (unless miss used) keeps the tools spigots engaged with the
'outer' piston - nothing more - otherwise the tool will lock up to
normal hand use.

Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
In article ,
Pete M wrote:
I spent about 3 hours trying to wind in the rear pistons on a new shape
Alfa GTV a couple of years ago, tried every trick and nothing would
shift 'em. Went out and bought a Sykes Pickavant piston windy tool and
it took me less than 5 minutes to sort it. Took 10 mins to do the
caliper on the other side (from wheel removal to replacement) - and that
one was a lot less free. Brilliant things. You can also buy a little
square multi-sided tool for doing the odd one, costs about £5 from most
semi-decent motor factors. If you're doing a lot of them, buy a proper
job - looks like a G-clamp, but works a lot better.

If I'd known about the proper tool when I had my P6, I'd have probably
had a decent handbrake.

Are you saying the tool you have works on the same principle as the proper
P6 one? I'm saying that was a poor design.

Not the original P6 tool, the one I used was a Sykes Pickavant one which
I think was for the Ford Granada Mk3 rear brakes. Brilliant it was.

However the proper tool doesn't effect the handbrake on the P6 - you have
to wind back the piston to fit new pads by whatever method. It's seizure
of the mechanism (and wrong cable adjustment) that stops it working
properly. The levers on the calipers *must* come back to their backstops
with the handbrake off for the self adjustment to work. And in perfect
condition this allows more handbrake travel than some MOT testers allow.
So people tighten the cable and f**k up the handbrake. I had to lay the
law down on more than one occasion at MOT time...

Yup, I remember that...

--
Pete M - OMF#9
Range Rover V8 Turbo
Range Rover 4.6 HSE
"Professional Petrolhead"

In article ,
:Jerry: wrote:
I dunno - it's just conceivable that a G clamp with enough friction
between its 'pad' and the piston could turn the piston. But I'm
sceptical.


But a G clamp will exert a pushing force to that is likely to damage
the ratchet mechanism as well as rotating the 'outer' piston,
I very much doubt that - the piston has to withstand the full force of the
hydraulics. Unless you got it off centre and bent the steel lug that
prevents it from turning in operation.

all the
proper Rover tool does (and all that is required) is a turning motion
[1] - what Conor is suggesting is like suggesting one can torque a
bolt down using a sledge-hammer, sure the force applied force the two
components together (akin to riveting...) but in doing so one is sure
to damage the fixing. What I'm saying is, the G clamp will exert far
more of a pushing force that it will a rotational force due to the
pitch of the respective threads (pitch of G clamp thread vs. the
thread of the adjuster)

I know - which is why I'm sceptical. But without trying it...

Anyway, the only way one could get a G clamp onto a P6 rear calliper
is to remove the unit first, rather suggests that Conor hasn't even
seen the P6 rear brake assembly let alone worked on it...

I'm not that sure - with both pads removed it might swing far enough away
from the disc to get some G-clamps in. But again I'm sceptical...

[1] even more modern designs don't like a pushing force applied, the
proper tools are designed to exert a turning force only, the means to
apply a pushing force is greatly limited by the design so that it
basically (unless miss used) keeps the tools spigots engaged with the
'outer' piston - nothing more - otherwise the tool will lock up to
normal hand use.

All I do know is the pukka Girling tool was a pain with the P6 - but
easier to use on outboard ones.

--
*Red meat is not bad for you. Fuzzy green meat is bad for you.

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.