The message

from contains these words:

Wonder what they will invent next - synchromesh? *Four wheel brakes?

Geoff MacK

The next version of this system is in development, and it could be on
this car, is starting the engine without the starter motor. The ECU
does a controled stop when the engine is switched off so it stops in a
certain position, then to start an injector fires and the plug sparks
and this starts the engine. This only works on a hot engine. This,
direct injection, turbo charging and loads of EGR will be standard on
all petrol engines in 10 years time.

Nothing new there. I am sure I remember an dealer demonstrating how he
could start a 1934 Bentley by triggering the magneto ignition.

--
Roger Chapman

On Sun, 10 Feb 2008 10:27:36 -0800 (PST), wrote:

On Jan 17, 9:56*am, "Geoff Mackenzie" wrote:
Heard on BBC World Service last night - a spokesman from Ford talking about
the new engine, due to be introduced in 2009. *Apparently it stops
automatically when the car is staionary, then restarts itself when you
depress the accelerator. *Wonderful for fuel consumption, emissions etc.
Quite revolutionary. *Except that he then admitted that they had introduced
something similar about five years ago, but it didn't really catch on - "not
seamless enough", whatever that means.

But - I'm quite sure this feature was available on a car in the twenties,
and quite possibly before the First *World War. *I think it was called
SilentStart, or something like that, but can't remember the manufacturer -
any ideas out there?

Wonder what they will invent next - synchromesh? *Four wheel brakes?

Geoff MacK

The next version of this system is in development, and it could be on
this car, is starting the engine without the starter motor. The ECU
does a controled stop when the engine is switched off so it stops in a
certain position, then to start an injector fires and the plug sparks
and this starts the engine. This only works on a hot engine. This,
direct injection, turbo charging and loads of EGR will be standard on
all petrol engines in 10 years time.

oh, is that the same as advancing the ignition (from a conveniently placed
lever on the steering column)?

Richard
Web pages: http://www.caravanningnow.co.uk/ for caravanning,
http://www.rcole.org/ for my personal web site and
http://www.homeindorset.co.uk because I love the email address.
--
I survived seven years in an Ankh-Morpork public school patronized be
the sons of gentleman. Compared to that, life among the D'regs holds
no terrors, I assure you. - Jingo by Terry Pratchett

On Sun, 10 Feb 2008 19:44:45 GMT, Roger
wrote:

The message

from contains these words:

Wonder what they will invent next - synchromesh? *Four wheel brakes?

Geoff MacK

The next version of this system is in development, and it could be on
this car, is starting the engine without the starter motor. The ECU
does a controled stop when the engine is switched off so it stops in a
certain position, then to start an injector fires and the plug sparks
and this starts the engine. This only works on a hot engine. This,
direct injection, turbo charging and loads of EGR will be standard on
all petrol engines in 10 years time.

Nothing new there. I am sure I remember an dealer demonstrating how he
could start a 1934 Bentley by triggering the magneto ignition.

There were quite few cars that could be started "on the button".
--
Peter Hill
Spamtrap reply domain as per NNTP-Posting-Host in header
Can of worms - what every fisherman wants.
Can of worms - what every PC owner gets!

Pedant's Corner

!934 is a bit late for a Bentley to have magneto ingnition. It's even late
for a Bentley to be a Bentley as by then they were a sort of sporting Rolls
Royce 20/25.

However almost anything with coil ingnition and a hand advance/retard stands
a chance of starting with a wiggle of that control provided the engine has
stopped in the right place.

Ron Robinson

"Roger" wrote in message
k...
The message

from contains these words:

Wonder what they will invent next - synchromesh? Four wheel brakes?

Geoff MacK

The next version of this system is in development, and it could be on
this car, is starting the engine without the starter motor. The ECU
does a controled stop when the engine is switched off so it stops in a
certain position, then to start an injector fires and the plug sparks
and this starts the engine. This only works on a hot engine. This,
direct injection, turbo charging and loads of EGR will be standard on
all petrol engines in 10 years time.

Nothing new there. I am sure I remember an dealer demonstrating how he
could start a 1934 Bentley by triggering the magneto ignition.

--
Roger Chapman

In article ,
Peter Hill wrote:
Nothing new there. I am sure I remember an dealer demonstrating how he
could start a 1934 Bentley by triggering the magneto ignition.

There were quite few cars that could be started "on the button".

I thought that was an old dealer expression meaning you pressed the
starter button rather than cranking by hand because the battery was
knackered?

--
*Everybody lies, but it doesn't matter since nobody listens*

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

In article ,
Roger wrote:
The message

from contains these words:

Wonder what they will invent next - synchromesh? Four wheel brakes?

Geoff MacK

The next version of this system is in development, and it could be on
this car, is starting the engine without the starter motor. The ECU
does a controled stop when the engine is switched off so it stops in a
certain position, then to start an injector fires and the plug sparks
and this starts the engine. This only works on a hot engine. This,
direct injection, turbo charging and loads of EGR will be standard on
all petrol engines in 10 years time.

Nothing new there. I am sure I remember an dealer demonstrating how he
could start a 1934 Bentley by triggering the magneto ignition.

Think a magneto can only produce a spark when the engine is turning. Coil
ignition will produce a spark if the coil is energised and the points
opened - done by moving the distributor via an advance/retard lever.

--
*I used up all my sick days so I called in dead

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
In article ,
Roger wrote:
The message

from contains these words:

Wonder what they will invent next - synchromesh? Four wheel brakes?

Geoff MacK

The next version of this system is in development, and it could be on
this car, is starting the engine without the starter motor. The ECU
does a controlled stop when the engine is switched off so it stops in a
certain position, then to start an injector fires and the plug sparks
and this starts the engine. This only works on a hot engine. This,
direct injection, turbo charging and loads of EGR will be standard on
all petrol engines in 10 years time.

Nothing new there. I am sure I remember an dealer demonstrating how he
could start a 1934 Bentley by triggering the magneto ignition.

Think a magneto can only produce a spark when the engine is turning. Coil
ignition will produce a spark if the coil is energised and the points
opened - done by moving the distributor via an advance/retard lever.

You are right. A magneto is effectively a high output dynamo, so it
needs to be turning to produce any output. By contrast, a coil produces
a spark when the circuit to it is broken (the spark occurs when the
points open)

The early Rolls Royces had both coil and magneto for reliability. But it
was the coil circuit that allowed the engine to be started by using the
advance/retard control.

I watched one being started like that at a car show. Impressive, but
eerie to watch. But the trick worked because there were lots of
cylinders, so one was always in the right position to fire, regardless
of where the engine stopped. I can't imagine any ECU controlling a
4-cylinder engine to stop it immediately after TDC with the contents of
the cylinder under compression, nor any residual petrol/air mixture
having enough power when fired to turn such an engine from stationary
through 180 degrees against the compression of the next cylinder to
fire. Are Fords going to start making V12s?

Jim

The message
from "R N Robinson"
contains these words:


Nothing new there. I am sure I remember an dealer demonstrating how he
could start a 1934 Bentley by triggering the magneto ignition.

Pedant's Corner

!934 is a bit late for a Bentley to have magneto ingnition. It's even late
for a Bentley to be a Bentley as by then they were a sort of sporting Rolls
Royce 20/25.

I thought everyone would know that WOBs business died with the Vintage
era so I deleted the Rolls that I had originally typed immediate prior
to Bentley.

However almost anything with coil ingnition and a hand advance/retard
stands
a chance of starting with a wiggle of that control provided the engine has
stopped in the right place.

I have no idea whether it was magneto ignition or not as that part of
the explanation came relatively recently, actually on this ng IIRC
correctly. However the actual demonstration was way back in the distant
past which is probably why I can remember it.

Back in 1963 a group of impoverished student apprentices found a 1934
Park Ward 3.5 for sale for £120 in a scrap yard in Staffordshire (near
Newport, Shropshire). Unfortunately (or perhaps fortunately) we could
only raise £90 between us and the dealer wouldn't budge. Anyway as I
remember it the car was already warmed up when we saw it and the switch
in question was an small inoccuous on/off switch on the dashboard.

--
Roger Chapman

On 11 Feb, 08:06, Jim Warren wrote:
Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
In article ,
* *Roger wrote:
The message

from contains these words:

Wonder what they will invent next - synchromesh? *Four wheel brakes?

Geoff MacK

The next version of this system is in development, and it could be on
this car, is starting the engine without the starter motor. The ECU
does a controlled stop when the engine is switched off so it stops in a
certain position, then to start an injector fires and the plug sparks
and this starts the engine. This only works on a hot engine. This,
direct injection, turbo charging and loads of EGR will be standard on
all petrol engines in 10 years time.

Nothing new there. I am sure I remember an dealer demonstrating how he
could start a 1934 Bentley by triggering the magneto ignition.

Think a magneto can only produce a spark when the engine is turning. Coil
ignition will produce a spark if the coil is energised and the points
opened - done by moving the distributor via an advance/retard lever.

You are right. A magneto is effectively a high output dynamo, so it
needs to be turning to produce any output. By contrast, a coil produces
a spark when the circuit to it is broken (the spark occurs when the
points open)

The early Rolls Royces had both coil and magneto for reliability. But it
was the coil circuit that allowed the engine to be started by using the
advance/retard control.

I watched one being started like that at a car show. *Impressive, but
eerie to watch. *But the trick worked because there were lots of
cylinders, so one was always in the right position to fire, regardless
of where the engine stopped. *I can't imagine any ECU controlling a
4-cylinder engine to stop it immediately after TDC with the contents of
the cylinder under compression, nor any residual petrol/air mixture
having enough power when fired to turn such an engine from stationary
through 180 degrees against the compression of the next cylinder to
fire. *Are Fords going to start making V12s?

Jim- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

They already do, AM DB9 etc.

smarshall ) gurgled happily, sounding much like they
were saying:

Are Fords going to start making V12s?

They already do, AM DB9 etc.

Ford sold Aston Martin last summer.